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Fix'ed Yellow's TBE Hover Problem
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dj k
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February 18, 2013 - 6:06 am

CPD said
I think that as long as it's non conductive, it'll be fine with the motherboard. I flew the yellow 107, and it was fine with the spray off from it. It's all over the inside of the heli because I did a fast version of running it off for a sequal video where I oil my 102. It's all over it the inside, and it has no issues as of now for the motherboard, just the dying motor.

oil (synthetic or petroleum) does not conduct electricity. heat, but thats all.

 

i wonder if graphite on/in the electronics might be another reason to shy away from it.

 

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dj k
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February 18, 2013 - 5:56 am

for all the folks talking about graphite...

 

i dont have any synthetic oil atm... so i was reaching for my graphite powder, and read the ingredients: Crystalline Silica (& obviously graphite powder). with the air this thing moves and the rpms those gears go, you'll be inhaling this stuff in no time. 

 

this seems like a bad idea to me, esp indoors.

 

is there a teflon lube that doesn't harden? or is the (sparing application of) synthetic/train oil 'safest'?

 

 

 

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CPD
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February 9, 2012 - 7:46 am

bobO said:

Certainly no offense meant on my part Dennis and yes I read every post carefully. My post was just meant as a foot note to those who my not realize that cheap battery's can be just that cheap and old. I've had my camera fail more then once by using battery's I've bought on the cheap at flea markets, even good brands that I guess were just way old. Just a heads up on my part that's all. You know there has been more then one person that couldn't get some thing or another working cause it wasn't plug in,lol.  Great posts and keep them coming.Laugh Sometimes I hate forums for just this reason things can be taken out of context or just the wrong way and cause hurt or harm when intentions are only meant to be good.Yell

like

/\

-I-I

-I-I

 

tumbs up fail. lol.

 

I try to read everything closely, it's just you end up soooo many down the line and I end up with all kinds of other stuff that I'm also doing, and sooooo many people I'm trying to keep track of. I've got the guys in my scout troop to remember all kinds of stuff about, plus trying to remember stuff about the 30 kids in my Jamboree troop, plus all of the kids I graduated with, plus the like 100 fellow engineering kids here, plus the guys from karate, plus the guys from the OA, plus my committee members, plus the rest of the 1000 people I've known through scouts, plus plus plus.

 

I guess right now it's "please, have mercy, don't make me a professor or teacher or anything where I have to learn about more than 1000 more people for the rest of my life!"

 

As a side note: might need to start a topic in the idle banter section with bobO-I don't have the opportunity anymore to go out and shoot like I'd want to, so my main camera's been collecting dust, but I've always enjoyed photography. Even since I was a kid with the cheap film camera I won by selling cub scout popcorn, I've just enjoyed the heck out of it. (first one was one that my mom's one English friend Fredrika sent as a christmas gift, and I've had a long line of others.) I love how the old fugi and the cannon I use as a video/seconday camera I had and my dad's two fugis and his current pentax use double A's-charge up a few sets, and roll. If you're out, and they run out while shooting, swap em, and if you have none left that are charged, run over to a gas station and buy a set or two. (very handy when you're hours from the house or motel, and need batteries) My 10D has these stupid proprietary rechargable, and that's a bit of a pain. (that and it uses stupid CF cards. I could see the original owner wanting to have the best and most stable car out there, but I hate paying the kind of cash it is for them, and the card readers out there for them just suck, and you allways bend the pins and stuff.

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Freeonthree
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February 9, 2012 - 7:41 am

bobO said:

Certainly no offense meant on my part Dennis and yes I read every post carefully. My post was just meant as a foot note to those who my not realize that cheap battery's can be just that cheap and old. I've had my camera fail more then once by using battery's I've bought on the cheap at flea markets, even good brands that I guess were just way old. Just a heads up on my part that's all. You know there has been more then one person that couldn't get some thing or another working cause it wasn't plug in,lol.  Great posts and keep them coming.Laugh Sometimes I hate forums for just this reason things can be taken out of context or just the wrong way and cause hurt or harm when intentions are only meant to be good.Yell

No offense taken, just wanted to let you know a little about my backround, so you would know im no newbie to RC or electronics, thats all.  These days, my main thing is riding my home built VW Trike, but staying home alot is alot cheaper than riding alot, so the heli's are actually saving me tons of money. I still have my yellow one, so im not dead in the water by any means, and life is good.  Dennis

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CPD
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February 9, 2012 - 7:26 am

Wheew. That's a LOT going on. I'll say you have a heck of a lot more experience than most of us here. (I think only SF and Supernova have that kind of experience)

 

Guess it all comes down to the luck of the draw. (note to self:when we have the s107 forum get together in Vegas, don't invite free... lol jk!)

 

I'm starting to really hate amazon right now myself-any time I want something, they either take it down a day later, jack the price up, or randomly screw somthing else up with it.

 

Never fails-90% of the time they do it.

 

Plus, I've been there on the used/rebuilt heli part-just look at my yellow one! It just plain sucks to get a half-fried heli.

 

The two things that defend them is the cheapness of prime shipping and their return service. My dad bought a massive computer monitor for photo editing, and it needed exchanged because it was flickering and really going bad. Asus's customer support was horrible, but Amazon's got the new one there, and shipped the old one out with 1 day shipping both ways so we could go on vacation.

(it's like a $500, 25 inch, 1900x2500 pixel screen that takes up some insane ammount of space and is supposed to have insane picture quality, granted the video card can't handle it, and he'll have to spend annother $100 to get one, and hope it's good enough--it's so old of a base computer now that the parts are hard to come by, since it was last rebuilt in 06, and used a generation old parts then)

 

Of course, we're thinking now that the old one, which we could not find the actual on/off button, was fried by the electric on/off, while the new one had the button right out, where we could use it.

 

I guess the moral of the story there is Amazon's decent to buy from, but is better suited to returns. 🙁

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bobO
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February 9, 2012 - 7:20 am

Certainly no offense meant on my part Dennis and yes I read every post carefully. My post was just meant as a foot note to those who my not realize that cheap battery's can be just that cheap and old. I've had my camera fail more then once by using battery's I've bought on the cheap at flea markets, even good brands that I guess were just way old. Just a heads up on my part that's all. You know there has been more then one person that couldn't get some thing or another working cause it wasn't plug in,lol.  Great posts and keep them coming.Laugh Sometimes I hate forums for just this reason things can be taken out of context or just the wrong way and cause hurt or harm when intentions are only meant to be good.Yell

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Freeonthree
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February 9, 2012 - 5:29 am

Im a 58 year old retired mechanic, and im also an advanced class amateur radio operator (ham radio), and im quite well versed in basic electronics, as well as batteries such as Nicad, NiMH, Lipo, gel cells, and lead acid, and the care and feeding thereof. I've also flown serious RC planes and Heli's, planes for 6 1/2 years, and heli's for 2 to 3 years. Im pretty sure I know what im doing...

Yellow is a nice little helicopter, and works perfectly.  never had any trouble with it other than fore/aft balance.

The Diamond Force heli I sent back wouldn't even take a charge (defective battery), and generally looked real cheap, so it went back.  It was an all glued together cheapie heli, and not the Diamond I thought I was getting, that was suposed to be all carbon fiber. It was just cheap plastic. Didn't look anything like the heli in the ad's video at all  :>(

The circuit board failed in red, did the same things with yellows tx, and new batteries. 

Blue flew fine, but was extremely noisey, and definently not a brand new, new version S107G. The tx was defective, and of course I tried new batteries, reds batteries, and yellows batteries. It flew fine with yellows tx. It also had two black end capped motors, and lacked the new version canopy markings. They sent me a possible old version, and possible return defective unit. Not to mention the strange styrofoam packing. Something definently wrong...

I guess you didn't really read my post, or all this would be obvious to you too. 

I'll let Amazons test team decide after they receive and inspect it, per my request not theirs. They wanted me to keep it and use it for spare parts. I want them to inspect it and see what was sent to me as a brand new heli.

Several of my friends have bought these heli's now too, all from Battery Superstore, and all yellow, and all of them so far are perfect, whew !  One more is showing up today, and my fingers are crossed tightly.  After his arrives, that should be all of them. Im just glad I got the defects, not any of my friends, who are also all ham radio operators.   Dennis 

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bobO
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February 9, 2012 - 12:24 am

Two things I have since I do digital photography, a battery tester and rechargeable battery's, only way to go.

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CPD
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February 8, 2012 - 11:49 pm

wow, that's really weird. I've never heard of people having THAT bad of luck with these, except dancer 026's. I wonder if there's something on your end of it that's wrong. (no offense or anything, just you have to wonder after 3 bad helis)

 

Something to check is those dollar store batteries--when they get weak, they start doing that. I know you were saying about testing them and stuff and them being good, but just for the heck of it, put a different set in. Also look at the reciver and see if it's bent in the way of the frame or something-that'll do it.

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Freeonthree
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February 8, 2012 - 4:15 pm

Well, I gave Blue a chance, but he either has a bent shaft or a funny gear. He also will suddenly stop and drop to the floor for no reason whatsoever. it's definently going back now. Buying these heli is like going to Las Vegas gambling. lol

Off to get me a return shipping label, zoooooooooooooooooooooom !

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Freeonthree
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February 8, 2012 - 2:34 pm

Well, I would assume were gunna be completely tearing these things down every 6 months for cleaning and lubing, so im not worried about the grease issue, I just want them to run sounding precision.

The Blue one is bad, sounds like a chipped gear, slight clicking sound, and generally real noisey compared to my Yellow one, and the tx is defective. Im sending it back.  I think im thru with these things after two bummers in a row. I'll keep Yellow, but I can't take this anymore.  Life is too short to keep dropping bad heli's off at UPS  Frown

 

This Blue one came with styrofoam in the box too, first one like that...

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CPD
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February 8, 2012 - 2:20 pm

Mine don't start glitching, they just stop turning on after so many days. lol. What I hate is the 102 controler's being a real pain because the kodak batteries are slightly too large, and get bound up, and don't make contact on the bottom row, and I have to get in there and shove them around with a screwdriver. Now, if I hit the powerball, and after I buy the real huey, and buy my $10,000 rc one, I'd use a new set every flight!

 

I would watch that grease, though, because some of hobby grease, like the lionel grease I was saying about, hardens to a rock after a while. 

 

Here's something to contemplate-Why would lionel, who pride themselves on a history of building trains that'll last forever, use and sell a grease that eventually hardens to a rock? I know on the one that I have that has it on there and it hardened, it was only a little bit of excess, took years, and it doesn't affect operation, but for pete's sake!

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Freeonthree
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February 8, 2012 - 12:03 pm

Car batts can sulfate, and read 13, 14 volts or more, but when a load is put against them, they fall on their nose.

Not sure if I ever saw a Nicad or NiMH batt do that though...  Hmmm...

When a 1.2 v battery is down to 1.2v, it's time to charge, and when a 1.5v batt gets down to 1.5v, there gone, at least for depending on them to control an expensive RC plane or heli.

When you have $300.00 to $1000.00 in the air, you simply don't fly on questionable battery voltage.

With these little heli's, I wait till it starts glitching, and then check em, and when yellow started glitching, they were down to about 1.3v. Those were 1.5v cheapies.  It may have been interference, but I really hate crashing, so I put a new set in.

How low have you guys gotten them to function properly in these IR tx's  without glitches, in a small room ?  

Blue is doing fine, and is perfect so far. I think I really like the silicone grease. It takes very little to do the job, and seems to hang in there really good. It may last a week or more, very nice...

Im gunna keep a close eye on em and see what gives. It sure don't fly off the gears teeth like oil though Laugh   Dennis 

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CPD
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February 8, 2012 - 10:05 am

I don't care too much-the good Kodak brand ones are from the factory in Japan--there's two factories that make ALL rechargable AA batteries-one in China that uses low quality materials, one in Japan that uses good materials. They lasted pretty good, and they're at the end of their lifespan. They last me like 3 days of use, and go dead from sitting for more than 5. They work plenty good in these remotes, and I don't feel like paying as much as batteries cost. (esp when I need to invest $10 in more pretty soon, since my LED lantern for camping needs a set of D's and my LED NRA Shotgun flashlight needs 3 AAA's)

 

They last long enough for me to fly more than I can or four of them last for a night of recording call of duty footage in my camera of the TV. (It's a wii, so it doesn't matter enough for me to care about forking over the money for a capture card--it's not like I'm making money doing those vids, I just kinda enjoy doing it)

 

As for how much voltage you're not having, my grandfather tested (he can't resist--he was a Westinghouse Electric Class I Tester for like ever and loved that job) a number of sets of batteries, and not only did he find that some of the batteries have less voltage and some have more, (usually varying from 1v to 2v) some had as much as 3 volts, and others had NEGATIVE 1.5 volts! Forget the miniscule .3v each, that's just crazy! I think the 3v and -1.5v were in the same set too!

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Freeonthree
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February 8, 2012 - 9:10 am

Im getting ready to take Red to Staples (UPS) for his trip to Kentucky.

Blue showed up this morning and is perfect, but was alot noisier than Yellow, so I administered a slight film of the brownish 100% silicone grease to all the gear teeth (you can see the brownish film), and it seems to stay put.

Im not sure yet what the consistancy of the Liquid Gears lubricant is, but if it's an oil, I think it's only good for the shaft, but not the gears. Im afraid it will just fly off the gears, and need constant re-oiling, and make a terrible mess over time.

I applied the grease with a small artists brush I shortened the brissels on, and just put a little on the end of the brissels, and dabbed it onto the teeth, but just a tiny bit, leaving a thin yet noticable brownish film that can be easily monitored with a glance. Now Blue is wisper quiet like yellow, and I won't be using anything but 100% silicone grease on the gears from now on. I think the Liquid gears is an oil, so i'll be using that to lube the shaft from the top, and let gravity do it's thing overnight.

Just a drop where the shaft enters the housing bore, maybe once a week should be great for that.  

In the video, you taked about rechargable batteries...

Nicads tend to be good for around 300 charges, or thats the way they were before I bailed on the RC hobby.

Now we have Nimh, and thats what I started using for my rec packs and my tx's. They worked better for me than Nicad's.

The problem with rechargables is that they start out at 1.2v, so you lose .3v per cell right out of the gate.

Times that by 6, and your losing 1.8v from the start.  

I got 10 days out of my first set of Dollar Store batts in Yellows tx before I started getting glitches in control. Put in a new set, and all is fine so far.  I guesss we didn't pay enough to get battery meters on our tx's, but thats ok. If we carsh, we just set em back up and go again. At the same time, I started turning the TV off, and staying away from bright lights, so im not really sure it was a low battery situation, but 10 days is pretty good as much as I fly, and they were down to an average of about 1.3 per cell, so maybe it was the TV or the lights I got too close to that was causing my glitches.

Guess I could give those batts another chance. Dennis

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CPD
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February 8, 2012 - 6:27 am

The ones that really look hard to lubricate, and need it, are the 018, 029 and 030 medium plastic helis. They look like they have just about no way to lube other than a complete tear down, or at least taking the body off.

 

They seem to have a lot of issues with those mediums, though.

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bvc
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February 8, 2012 - 4:38 am

The s111g is open on the bottom as well. Lubed my daughters w/silicone.

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CPD
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February 8, 2012 - 2:38 am

 

There's the new vid on lubing the 102. I don't know about the other military helis how they could be lubed, since many are enclosed like the 111g. The 102 and helis like it have an open triangle, where the long needle of the train oil can get to the teeth, and there isn't going to be as much splatter from the excess.

 

Too bad we can't get the title changed over to "Syma Oiling and Quik-E-Lube" or something. Love how it's not about tbe, but is on topic, and not idle banter. lol.

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CPD
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February 8, 2012 - 1:13 am

I think that as long as it's non conductive, it'll be fine with the motherboard. I flew the yellow 107, and it was fine with the spray off from it. It's all over the inside of the heli because I did a fast version of running it off for a sequal video where I oil my 102. It's all over it the inside, and it has no issues as of now for the motherboard, just the dying motor.

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bobO
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February 8, 2012 - 12:59 am

Great vid and discussion.  finally got around to reading the bottle on the graphite oil and it's a penetrating oil for metal. I've only used it to oil the shafts and haven't used it on the gears and don't think I will. So its the needle bottle and liquid bearings or the Teflon spray. I'm going to hit the local RC hobby shop and see what he has in stock. My two main concerns are foaling up the motherboard and attracting hairs, lint etc. I do have graphite powder but just not sure about that stuff.

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