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Quad Copter.
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Raptor
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May 12, 2012 - 10:01 am

The issue i am having was the shaft dropping down when the props where stationary.

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The drive cogs on all of my copters with the bottom removed have the same problem Cry, the solution is probably just cutting the shafts down.

I pushed the prop up when the motor was spinning and ended up removing a tooth from the gear cog, i've done this twice nowEmbarassed. (anybody got 2 spare cogs they don't want?)

 

I received another 2x (fake?) S107's in the post today, so I now have all of the copter's i need, to butcher into a quadcopterLaugh.

 

All that is needed now is a good frame design.  From the idea that the tail booms are one of the strongest parts, i am starting to design a frame where a 3mm X 200mm rod is connected between two of the helicopters where the tail boom used to be, and brazing the second pair perpendicular to them.

Here's a very rough draft of what the fame may look like.

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CPD
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May 12, 2012 - 1:08 am

Actually, the point of that was originally the heli was going to be completly stripped down to put into a model of a UH-1 huey. Unfortunatly, it's not powerful enough to fly the kinda heavy fuselage of either a 1:48 UH-1H (which turned out to be a metal model >:( ) or a plastic 1:48 UH-1B (which wasn't the huey I wanted to fly anyway)

 

I think if you get a 1:72 model, it could lift that, but not a 1:48. (Unfortunatly, I wanted a 1:48 because that would match up with my O-scale model trains)

 

As far as the shafts dropping, they fell a little, but it looks like they're meant to do it to a certain extent. You have to remember that actually, the issue isn't them dropping, it's them loosing their grip and the blades flying off. They pull upward very hard, you know! Wink 

 

I don't know about the gyro, but it had so much lift, even at a slight idle, and was off-balance enough, that the rear was heavy enough to let it just flip over and hit my hand. You need to keep some weight on the front for it to not simply flip over. I thought, "Hey, why not just try to fly it once and see how fast it can fly beign that light?" Obviously, it didn't work. Just a fuel (or in this case battery) to noise converter.

 

And for anybody thinking the heli was harmed, that's my speed-107 now, with plastic lower frames, no rear stabalizing bars, and the "fake" heli's spare rear blade. (The fakes have a better pitch and size rear prop, but not as big as my speed rotors had, since they made it go too fast to control.)

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Supernova
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May 11, 2012 - 1:06 am

CPD, you cant fly a box of spare parts mate.  Confused

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Raptor
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May 10, 2012 - 8:54 pm

LOL, OK ConfusedConfusedLaughSmile

How did you stop the central drive shaft from dropping down, and removing some teeth off the cogs? (actually I think I removed the sleeve from mine... oops)

 

Essentially that's as naked I would like to get the copters, and attach then to the central control box with the tail boom.

 

(oh, the main reason why it doesn't fly, is because its Gryo is on the wrong axis and "wobbles", so it is unable to correct the rotation properly. i.e. the feedback loop is wrong)

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John
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May 10, 2012 - 6:30 pm

Gee watch your digits (fingers)-heli looks really naked.

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CPD
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May 10, 2012 - 1:33 pm

The other thing is that if you take off all of the metal from the heli, you have to do something about the motors poping out...

 

 

When you take off the sides, the motors can tend to pop out like in my video. Also, they kinda need to have some weight on them to keep them from flying too high or flipping over. Also, if you use the tail booms, they're much, much stronger for their weight than anything else you could put on the heli.

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Raptor
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May 10, 2012 - 9:17 am

nice idea, i really like the thought of using the tail booms as the support rods, that ingeniousSurprisedSmile

However in my mind i was thinking of stripping off all of the excess metal, and the base carriage that contains the control board, to just leave the motor mount plastic. However this does pose the question of how do you attach it to the x-copter frame (and how to keep the drive shafts in place), and as a result I will most likely now use your method of using the tail booms.

 

I will go with the wooden option to start with, its a very familiar medium, that I've done a lot of modding with it over the years. And if its successful, then i can upgrade it to a metal frame in the future, exactly as you said.

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CPD
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May 10, 2012 - 8:14 am

What I would do would be take the tailboom from the s107's, and run the wires to the motors inside of them. Then I would build a basswood (not balsa-balsa's too fragile) box for the electronics, with four holes in the sides of the box, Dollhouse or other small woodworking hinges on one side of the lid and a dollhouse locking mechanism. I would then take the four tailbooms without the black plastic end on them, put them through the four holes and then put the black plastic end back on and hot glue in place. Then run the wires through and put wire connectors on them somehow so you can disconnect them, unscrew the tailboom and remove the motor set when you need to do repairs or want to swap out motors.

 

Once you've got it down to where it works good, I would then look around for metal modeling supplies (like http://www.hobbylinc.com/hobby....._wire_rods --you can also try the hardware store) and make a sheet metal version, using angle-"iron" on the edges of the box, gluing it all together with crazy glu or sheet metal screws. (prefered for longer life) When you bend the corners, just remember to cut counter 45 degree cuts where you are bending it and file all of the non-factory edges and coat with something (or just paint it all) to reduce the probability of getting cut.

 

I would use the metal one if you plan on needing it to last a long time, but the wooden one would be a lot cheaper and easier. Just my model builder recomendation.

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Raptor
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May 10, 2012 - 6:35 am

Sorry for the 3 posts in a row 😛

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Ive started to collect the parts I think I need to make a Quad copter, Cool

Ordered another 2 "broken" S107's from amazon for their pars (just hoping that nothings too broken)

And as far as I can tell this is a good, cheap control board http://www.hobbyking.com/hobby.....8_PA_.html

Once I receive these parts, I can start to look into making some PIC speed controllers, and figuring outs its start up calibration cycle.

 

However I'm not quite sure what to use for the frame yet, I'm thinking of using something along the lines of  PVC pipe, or balsa wood, Confused any suggestions?

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Raptor
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May 9, 2012 - 10:11 am

 Correction: this design could be obtained quite easily by just BUYING a pre-made control circuit :facepalm: and then I don't need to design or program that part 😛

I can also design/make some really cheap, lightweight speed controllers using my PIC chips, and a few power MOSFETS.

Here's a very rough mockup, of what i think would be needed to make a suitable speed controller. (adapted from one of the designs I use on my boats)

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Raptor
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May 9, 2012 - 9:51 am

Aww, Thank you EmbarassedLaugh

I just love to tinker, and I learn from my mistakes, and I make my fair share of themEmbarassed

I am intrigued with CPD's idea of making a quad copter out of 4x S107's, and will have a look into making one once I can find some time to learn how to code Atmel AVR chip's (I'm just getting happy programming PIC's, and now I realize the world has moved to AVR Cry)

 

As he implied, remove the internal circuit of the helicopter, and connect the circuit directly to the central processor.

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Supernova
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May 9, 2012 - 4:15 am

Hay Raptor you are one smart cookie, the sort of man we need here SmileSmileSmileSmileSmileCool

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Raptor
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May 8, 2012 - 10:01 am

I have the data sheet for the gyroscope used on the S107G.

To disable the gyroscopic function you would have to feed the chip with a 1.35V signal, to allow the control chip to think that the angular velocity is 0

for every degree turned per second the voltage changes by 0.67mv (0.00067V)

The way to obtain the 1.35v signal would be to use the reference voltage on pin 1 of the gyroscope.

 

However wouldn't it be simpler, and more stable it all 4 helicopters shared the same gyroscope?

 

Oh, and you can obtain cheap S107's from a shop on amazon UK. (I think they may be fakes?) They are "broken" returns for £6 with free shipping.

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fb39ca4
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May 8, 2012 - 8:02 am

IJR, the S107s would have to be non-gyro, or they will each try to correct themselves individually on the yaw axis.

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CPD
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May 1, 2012 - 11:39 pm

The site does it automatically when you put a youtube url into the site.

 

With the motherboard as a speed controller, I'm not quite sure how to get that to work--wouldn't they have to be hooked up to the main motherboard, then what? They have to get their signal from the remote to do anything, or would you hook it up so that the main mb acts as the controler and do some changes to the hardware?

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fb39ca4
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May 1, 2012 - 11:23 am

Amazing stuff^

How do you embed Youtube videos?

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fb39ca4
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Guests
May 1, 2012 - 8:29 am

It is still a lot cheaper than building a quadcopter 100% from scratch. I am actually interested in purrsuing this after I finish building my normal quadcopter. I actually think it would be better to leave the circuit boards on the Symas, as they are essentially free, lightweight speed controllers, which would otherwise have to be bought separately. A signal wire can easily be connected where the IR sensor went, and with knowledge of the communication protocol, the central processor can send signals just like the remote did. In the end this should still be cost efficient, as motors and speed controllers for a lightweight quadcopter would cost $20x4, and here we are getting 2 motors, 2 sets of rotors, and a speed controller for $20. This would actually be an Octocopter, making it even better.

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CPD
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May 1, 2012 - 4:36 am

An s107, stripped to the bone, can prodiuce a pretty good ammount of lift. Four of them together could probably lift a quadrocopter. The only thing is that they can't lift more than a little bit of weight alone. They can lift just about the weight of their bodies plus a pen or something. The thing with a quadrocopter is that you would need a much larger battery, but would need less body and relativly less motherboard, since the weight of a slightly larger MB would be distributed to all four sets of rotors. The trouble would be finding the 4 s107's with good motors and rotor sets but broken other parts to make it cost efficient, and finding a motherboard for the quadrocopter. That would be probably $20-50, I think, and the four s107's would cost $80-100 if you bought all brand new ones. It's really only something for SF to try, since he has the boxes upon boxes of broken down s107's.

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fb39ca4
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May 1, 2012 - 2:23 am

How much thrust does a S107 produce?

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Syma Freak
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April 27, 2012 - 6:49 pm
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CPD said
Hmmm... How many s107's with blown boards but working motors and rotor sets do you have? 4 ressurected s107's with the motors all wired up to counter-spin, some styrene for the arms, a huge 3.7v battery, and the motherboard for a quadrocopter, and you should be ready to go!

CPD I like the idea!!

"Fly like a butterfly sting like a Syma" http://syma107.com

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